This is the funniest thing I’ve seen all week.

And, Richard? It’s admirable for you to be sensitive about possible stereotyping, but you’re being overly sensitive here. First of all, Spongebob ALWAYS has buck teeth! Look:

http://www.poster.net/spongebob/spongebob-spongebob-squarepants-9962695.jpg

Second of all, even in this episode where Spongebob is a Chinese Communist, he still has blue eyes.

Third of all, and most importantly, Spongebob is…welll, um…he’s a sponge. How is it possible to be racist about a sponge?

August 12, 2007 @ 4:13 pm | Comment

The original SpongeBob has buck teeth, so that ought to be OK, right? I think the only thing they changed on that character was the shape of the eyes. Here’s a press release that has a response from the producers to charges of racism.

August 12, 2007 @ 4:15 pm | Comment

Thanks guys – the embarrassing truth is I’ve never watched Spongebob and I didn’t know he always had buck teeth. So I’m not ambivalent anymore; I don’t think it’s racist. And yes, it’s damned funny.

August 12, 2007 @ 4:31 pm | Comment

And zhwj, thanks for that excellent link.

August 12, 2007 @ 4:36 pm | Comment

neggirboy (4 hours ago) Marked as spam
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Fascinating, “neggirboy”! AMERICA, FUCK YEAH!!

Is lead in Chinese-made toys responsible for the sad state of America’s youth?

August 12, 2007 @ 6:20 pm | Comment

If Spongebob were really in Chinese waters he’d be surrounded by the corpses of extinct dolphins and brown or black sludge.

I’d also like to see two hundred dancing girls dressed up like Spongebob in a CCTV gala event:
“Spongebob’s Patriotic Friends In The Taiwan Straits”

August 12, 2007 @ 6:59 pm | Comment

I found it reasonably funny, though I’d already seen it before (so it wasn’t fresh).

August 12, 2007 @ 7:00 pm | Comment

There should be a part about Spongebob hating America’s freedom and democracy, warranting an invasion without overwhelming consent.

August 12, 2007 @ 7:28 pm | Comment

Richard I think you’ve been in China too long! The comments are juvenille of course, but racist? The CCP wants the Chinese people to believe the CCP represents “Chinese” but thats propaganda brainwashing. The CCP is from Marx and Lenin etc, it’s not Chinese and have you forgotten that the CCP started out by destroying Chinese culture?

So to characterize a commentary on the CCP as racist worries me. It’s wrong to say people are such and such cause of their skin color right but whatever sins they commit post natally are fair game for criticism, that’s the way it should be. If someone is evil and wrong, people have the right and duty to stand up and make it known.

Besides, every thing implied in the commentary seemsed truthful in nature so what’s wrong with criticising something bad? The idea that evil partis should be protected from criticism is a very dangerous and communist mind trick. There is such a thing as good and bad, bad is bad and good is good, so what’s wrng with acknowledging this kind of thing?

That’s one thing I have to criticize about this site, people seem too communist to say whats good or bad right and wrong, they want everything to be equal and they seem to even believe in this bunk philosophy that sitting on the fence is correct.

Thatnks for the great video link, I thought it was a good one, the guy was too smart to resort to petty racism, good for him, or her…

August 13, 2007 @ 3:00 am | Comment

this reminds me of the whole cartoon allah farce. many of us think it’s funny but the natives may find it offensive. it’s not necessarily because the natives are “conditioned” to be against these parodies. this type of western satire may just be non-existent in another culture.

i think one problem is that putting mao there makes chinese twitch. how many chinese would agree to use mao as their national symbol nowdays? and to a fair extent, how much ideological legacy of mao is left.

the video does a good job in terms of highlighting some core issues surrounding china now. but again, one has to shrug it off when equating china to just a simple communist regime. maybe better if it’s titled spongebob under chinese government.

similarly in terms of equating government to ppl, many europeans think ALL americans are for Iraq war cuz americans re-elected bush. oh, man…

August 13, 2007 @ 5:08 am | Comment

Well, Spongebob as a fenqing just completes the picture for me. More so because last year the right wing wackos in the US began saying that Spongebob was really a cartoon representation of a gay man and that Spongebob was created solely for the purpose of making homosexuality more acceptable to American kids.

I can definitely see Chairman Spongebob as a ultranationalist forced into the closet. Angry at foreigners for everything but secretly wishing some local girl would take interest in him instead of the myriad of foreigners.

August 13, 2007 @ 7:47 am | Comment

“every thing implied in the commentary seemsed truthful in nature”

You must be mentally retarded or have never been to China, then. Size and scale are everything, like I said. Idiotic anecdotes don’t help.

“secretly wishing some local girl would take interest in him instead of the myriad of foreigners.”

Most of the foreign marriages are to Japanese, Taiwanese, Hong Kongers, Canadian Chinese, Australian Chinese, and American Chinese.

Which isn’t helping the gender ratios.

August 13, 2007 @ 12:11 pm | Comment

“Most of the foreign marriages are to Japanese, Taiwanese, Hong Kongers, Canadian Chinese, Australian Chinese, and American Chinese.”

It is refreshing that you acknowledge Taiwanese people as foreign to China, which of course, they are.

I’m not sure there isn’t a problem with your reference to “Canadian Chinese, Australian Chinese, and American Chinese.” I think you must mean Chinese (ethnically speaking) American etc. If they are not foreign by ethnicity then they must be foreign by nationality.

Further, I’m not sure that the ethnic distinction is in any way relevant; surely such suitors can be simply called ‘American’ or ‘Australian.’ Unless, that is, you’ve let slip a degree of racism in your own thinking.

August 13, 2007 @ 7:22 pm | Comment

Oh…good…god…

Has EVERYONE on this blog lost their sense of humour? (Nausicaa, my friend, where art thou?)

Come on. Around a year ago, this thread would have evolved into multifarioius surrealist humourous scenarios, with me painting BIZARRE scenes of CCTV gala events while Nausicaa and others chime in.

And on that note: Richard, my true and loyal friend, whenever this blog ceases to be fun, then you’ll know it’s time to end it.

BUT, Richard, for as long as I continue to post here, there will always be at least a LITTLE bit of fun on TPD. I’m the canary in the coal mine, if you see what I mean. 😉 And I’m still here…

Oh, by the way, I’m rather drunk right now – which kind of proves my point…. 😉 🙂

August 14, 2007 @ 12:30 am | Comment

“Further, I’m not sure that the ethnic distinction is in any way relevant; surely such suitors can be simply called ‘American’ or ‘Australian.’ Unless, that is, you’ve let slip a degree of racism in your own thinking. ”

Pay attention. Nanhe was talking about a foreigners in the ethnic sense.

August 14, 2007 @ 1:30 am | Comment

“Further, I’m not sure that the ethnic distinction is in any way relevant; surely such suitors can be simply called ‘American’ or ‘Australian.’ Unless, that is, you’ve let slip a degree of racism in your own thinking. ”

Pay attention. Nanhe was talking about a foreigners in the ethnic sense.

August 14, 2007 @ 1:31 am | Comment

“Nanhe was talking about a foreigners in the ethnic sense.”

Precisely. Nationality first; ethnicity second. Retrace your steps and unscramble your brain until the light comes back on. Then you will see; perhaps.

August 14, 2007 @ 3:37 am | Comment

Precisely? He was taking a jab at Chinese men, I think you need to improve your reading comprehension.

August 14, 2007 @ 4:48 am | Comment

@ferins:

I didn’t take a “jab” at Chinese men ie racism as you are suggesting. Chinese women are going for foreign men like it or not and I made pains to get reasons for this preference. The reasons I was told are as follows:

1. “The Western man is a bad boyfriend, the Chinese man is a bad husband (in reference to cheating and possibly abuse).

2. “Chinese men have bad hygiene” I already knew about “death breath” having nearly fainted on many a subway and taxi. For future reference, baking soda and water is an acceptable substitute for toothpaste for clean teeth and fresh breath.
Back to hygiene, foot hygiene was another topic brought up when I would get foot massages. And lastly, I was told that Chinese men don’t clean their “man gear”. That alone is reason enough I guess.

August 14, 2007 @ 5:02 am | Comment

pft, excuses. they’re after money. russian women in japan and china will say russian men are drunks, violent, etc etc, same thing. it’s just a euphemism :p

August 14, 2007 @ 5:06 am | Comment

@Ferins

So are you racist or misogynist, or both? That might be a little rude….ok…is it just that you don’t like the other colours and the penisless?

August 14, 2007 @ 5:51 am | Comment

ferins:

Stop making excuses, brush your teeth and take a hot, soapy shower NOW.

And wash EVERYTHING.

August 14, 2007 @ 7:45 am | Comment

Ivan, stick around. I’ll be back to blogging full-time in exactly one year.

August 14, 2007 @ 9:03 am | Comment

you guys are weird ( :;

August 14, 2007 @ 1:34 pm | Comment

it’s shit like this that gets us called a faction of quacking canards jk jk hahahaha

August 14, 2007 @ 3:38 pm | Comment

Richard, I hope you’ll get out of China, or at least out of Beijing, before the Olympics, because it’s going to get really ugly and a lot of people, including foreigners (perhaps especially foreigners) are going to get hurt. Remember the Boxer “rebellion.”

August 14, 2007 @ 3:42 pm | Comment

I wasn’t offended by the video, but I didn’t find it very funny either…. I thought instead of stereotyping the Chinese laborers and such, that it was more of a kind of…well…not so much “public awareness”, but to some extent anyways.

August 14, 2007 @ 4:31 pm | Comment

As we’re wandering in and out of the twilight zone here, this priceless piece from ESWN:

http://www.zonaeuropa.com/20070812_1.htm

If Charlie was still at CD he’d be my number one suspect.

August 14, 2007 @ 9:59 pm | Comment

Stuart, thanks for that great link. Amazing.

Ivan, I’ll be here for the Olympics – if I last that long.

August 14, 2007 @ 11:54 pm | Comment

Yes, there’s going to be a Boxer Rebellion and World War 3. Run while you all can!

August 15, 2007 @ 12:15 am | Comment

The next Boxer Rebellion will be part of China’s disintegration, after which the foreign powers will see to it that the concept of “china” only exists in history books for all eternity.

August 15, 2007 @ 1:25 am | Comment

Ivan, what do you know? I guess the party would ask you the same thing. I assume you are outside China… Do you have friends in China who know the truth? I know theres a lot of people in China who know the truth but it seems they dont really know how to act on it… Theres still a lot of folks who mindlessly maintain party membership, what of them if theres some kind of happening?

Anyway, maybe we don’t have to get into it.

Nanhey whatchou talkin about? How can China disintegrate? It’s so huge… whats the point of busting up a country like that, why not leave them alone if the CCP is gone. The international community will have nothing against China sans CCP right, and I dont think the people of China want to forget about their 5000 years culture (again/more) Why shouldn’t China be free and fine in the end? At least I hope for that and I think it can work as long as the people wake up…

August 15, 2007 @ 9:18 am | Comment

No Boxers spotted til now. They were those guys with the funny moves, weren’t they?

Will watch out.

August 15, 2007 @ 3:52 pm | Comment

Just wait until China is defeated in a few events. If Japan defeats China in just one single Olympic event, all hell will break loose.

August 15, 2007 @ 4:23 pm | Comment

I wonder which foreigner will get the blame for that “cut and paste” mishap at China Daily?

Link again: http://www.zonaeuropa.com/20070812_1.htm

August 15, 2007 @ 6:55 pm | Comment

“Just wait until China is defeated in a few events. If Japan defeats China in just one single Olympic event, all hell will break loose.”

This should do it:

The Marathon enters the final stages with the long time Chinese leader, Lightning Li, being run down by a rapidly-closing competitor, Makido Rapido of Japan. The expectant stadium crowd have been gripped by the action unfolding on the big screen for the last two hours; the atmosphere is reaching fever pitch, bordering on frenzy, as the Chinese athlete enters the stadium first.

But wait. The lead is now down to 20m. The roof of the bird’s nest is pulsating with the nationalistic and fragile pride of 80 000 delirious flag wavers. With one lap remaining, the noise is deafening. The leader, with the glory of the motherland weighing heavily in his tired limbs, begins to falter. Rapido, the jet from Japan, senses an opportunity to enshrine himself in the hearts of his people for all eternity.

As the two athletes, now shoulder-to-shoulder, enter the home straight for the final desperate dash to the finishing line, the prospect of defeat at the hands of Japan sends feelings and blood pressure to an all time high. Olympic spirit is by now something that can only be found on supermarket shelves.

It�s torso for torso; who�s going to take the gold? Li noses in front, Rapido points a toe, Li�s gonna get there, Rapido�s rallying. Li from Rapido; Rapido from Li. Who�s it gonna be? Li…Rapido�Li�Rapido�Li�Rapido�Li�RAPIDO WINS THE GOLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The furore abates. Rapido offers his hand to the vanquished Li before wearily embracing his coach, accepting from him the Japanese flag for the victory lap. Silence descends.

Within the silence, hearts burn with indignation as the stadium turns into a seething cauldron of unresolved issues. Sounds begin to emerge from the humiliated multitude. A whistle here; a jeer there. Boos echo around the architecture. A few Japanese flags wave bravely against the chorus of hate. Then something, or someone, snaps…….

The rest, as they say, will be history.

August 15, 2007 @ 7:20 pm | Comment

stuart, your satire is quite juvenile. what sort of name is makido rapido? sounds like something a U.S. TV station would call the Jap character on a post-WW2 TV series. Anyhow, I highly doubt that the Chinese will boo like crazy. Indeed, in the last asian cup, the Chinese didn’t do a damned thing when they got beaten by Japan, even though it was pretty clear the refs missed a handball call that led to the Japanese initial goal.

August 16, 2007 @ 4:48 am | Comment

“The next Boxer Rebellion will be part of China’s disintegration, after which the foreign powers will see to it that the concept of “china” only exists in history books for all eternity.”

Nah I think China would start the nuclear exchange to ensure mutual destruction, and the world can finally be free of G8 parasites.

August 16, 2007 @ 6:00 am | Comment

minus Canada and Japan.

August 16, 2007 @ 6:01 am | Comment

snow:

Tibet, E. Turkestan and S. Mongolia are liberated. Taiwan tells Beijing to shove it and takes its seat on the WTO and strolls into the UN. Beijing will be too weak to stop HK from getting back to a world level economic and shipping city and taking Macau with it.

Regions such as Guangdong/Sichuan/Fujian and Shanghai/Zhejiang/Jiangsu/Anhui would find greater economic growth and global political acceptance as separate entities than following Beijing in lockstep, regardless of the consequences.

NE China may in part rejoin with Korea, but most of “china” north of the yellow river and west/southwest of Xian is already a wasteland and pretty much unsalvageable.

August 16, 2007 @ 6:14 am | Comment

continued-

Beijing nukes European Russia off the face of the planet. They dump several million tons of toxic waste and poison gas into the eastern tradewinds headed to America.

Everyone dies.

August 16, 2007 @ 6:55 am | Comment

“…in the last asian cup, the Chinese didn’t do a damned thing when they got beaten by Japan…”

There were riots throughout Beijing when Japan defeated China in the Asian Cup in 2004. (Don’t gainsay me on this, t-co; I was there.) The Olympics will be like the Asian Cup on steroids. Literally on steroids as far as the Communist pigs go…

August 16, 2007 @ 10:22 am | Comment

I Very Much Dislike the Word “Reform”

There are many words that I dislike very much, such as “democracy”, “human rights”, “freedom”. There is another word I dislike, and that is “reform”. This post wants to explain my dislike of this word.

The Chinese Communist Party recently passed a decision called “The Decision to Enhance The Governing Abilities of Our Party”. In the first paragraph of that document, it said “Hostile forces’ attempts to Westernize and disunite our country have not changed”.

But, how are the hostile forces trying to Westernize and disunite China? One common technique is to use the banner of “Reform” to change the color of China’s Socialist System.

Let me first comment on Deng Xiaoping to illustrate the importance of sometimes not “reforming”. Deng Xiaoping, in 1989, resisted great pressure from Rightists to “reform”, and we all know what he did that year. I believe what he did in 1989 takes a lot more courage and determination than any type of “reform”.

We know that in the early days of China’s economic opening up, Hu Yaobang and Zhao Ziyang were the right and left hands of Deng Xiaoping. Looking back today, those two were economic “reformists”, and as a result, Deng Xiaoping were dissatisfied with them. But those two were supported by many overseas rightists and domestic intellectuals. But Deng Xiaoping still fired those two people despite so much popular support they receive. This again takes extreme courage.

Then Li Peng and Jiang Zemin took over. I believe those two did a great job in implementing Deng Xiaoping’s policy, which was basically: “Both hands have to be hard, and cannot be even a little soft”. I was a rightist back then, and did not like those two people. I thought those two people were too conservative, and not “reformist” enough.

(Note how I put quotes around the word reform. Some reforms are necessary, such as tighter media controls. But to rightists, they have a different view on reform. They believe that a “reform” is any activity that goes against China’s Constitution. For example, China’s Constitution clearly says that government officials are elected indirectly through representatives. But rightists insist on promoting “direct elections”, trying to break the Constitution. Also, the Constitution clearly says that the Chinese Communist Party is the core leadership of the Chinese people, but the rightists insist that this is a dictatorship and not democracy. Rightists often sing praises of the importance of Constitutions, so why do they not respect China’s Constitution?)

Anyway, then came the collapse of the USSR. I was very naive back then, and I thought that: “This is such good news for the people of USSR. They captured that opportunity. China unfortunately missed that opportunity, USSR people will start to enjoy happier and better lives because of this reform”.

What happened afterwards to the USSR completely changed my viewpoints.

In the early days of the Chinese economic opening up, many of China’s economic structures were modeled exactly after certain aspects of West’s system. But today, we can see that the West’s capitalist system is already almost collapsing, and so now China’s future direction is totally unclear. Can China continue to model itself after the West’s system? I do not believe so. The West is burning Chinese stores, adding tariffs for Chinese steel and shoe imports, subsidizing agricultures. Even for HK, can HK still be an example for the mainland? I do not think so. Can Taiwan be an example for the Mainland? I do not think so.

In other words, there’s no much left that’s valuable to learn from the West’s system.

Therefore, a lot of times resisting reforms is more important than carrying out reforms and takes more courage. I was in Shenzhen a few months ago, and I saw a Deng Xiaoping quote displayed as a slogan on the street: “We will not change our fundamental path for 100 years”. Therefore, anyone who wants to challenge the Chinese Constitution, to change the leadership position of the Chinese Communist Party, to change the dominance of state-owned enterprises, I think they should wait for at least another 100 years.

Rightists always yell “If China does not reform this and that, it’ll……”. Well, they’ve been yelling for decades, and China is still doing pretty well, but many of those Rightists have died out….

August 16, 2007 @ 10:24 am | Comment

“There were riots throughout Beijing when Japan defeated China in the Asian Cup in 2004. (Don’t gainsay me on this, t-co; I was there.) The Olympics will be like the Asian Cup on steroids. Literally on steroids as far as the Communist pigs go…”

I’m thinking there will be a crackdown since this is a much bigger event, but god forbid some common sense impedes on your fantasy of China being harmed in some way or another.

August 16, 2007 @ 11:12 am | Comment

ferins, are you suggesting that China has never been – nor continues to be “harmed in some way” by the Communists?

That’s beneath the contempt I have for dogshit.

August 16, 2007 @ 11:22 am | Comment

“What happened afterwards to the USSR completely changed my viewpoints.”

I guess Math shares the Mainland Chinese dislike of clean toilets, then. (Russia’s toilets improved immensely after the Communists went down the, um, toilet.)

August 16, 2007 @ 11:27 am | Comment

@t_cup

“…it was pretty clear the refs missed a handball call that led to the Japanese initial goal.”

Now that’s juvenile. Embodied in that line is a chronic case of bad loser syndrome. It is precisely this mentality that is likely to provoke trouble if and when a close call goes against a Chinese athlete. You have demonstrated Ivan’s point very well.

August 16, 2007 @ 12:20 pm | Comment

Mathy,

Oh so Deng Xiaoping said if anyone wants to change the constitution or criticize the CCP they should wait 100 years does he? Oh well, guess we all better sit tight then eh mathy,,,? Guess if Deng says that the “greatest good” is to wait 100 years and let the CCP reign as God of our minds for one hundred years, … (and dont tell me CCP is not a religion of deng worship and jiang fearing and Hu revering…)

Like whatever math, Deng xiaoping is just an opportunist and a scammer like all CCP agents except maybe that Tienanmen helping guy….and maybe a few others but the ones who make it to the top is because they are the ones most willing to sell out their consciences and monipulate the minds of the masses at will.

Deng said, how stupid. Of course the CCP doesn’t want anyone to criticize it, its right scared of criticism cause it is illegitimate.

You are an agent mathy i can tell cause you say “china is doing quite well” thats bull. Anyone can do what China has done if they pull out all the stops and dont care about human rights and trample on everything just to look good in a snapshot.

And what he said is extra double bull cause the CCP always changes the constitution everytime it feels a little gassy it just oops changes the education system there, demobilizes any system of justice there, muzzles the media a touch here, and oops a little editing of history here and here. Math, the CCP is not courageous, what they do to manipulate is the most cowardly thing they could do, they couldn’t be more unscrupulous. They are fearful mobsters who are desperate and willing to do anything to get what they want wthout deserving anything.

August 16, 2007 @ 1:00 pm | Comment

“ferins, are you suggesting that China has never been – nor continues to be “harmed in some way” by the Communists?

That’s beneath the contempt I have for dogshit.”

Comparing modern China to Mao era China and thinking China is communist in anything but name would truly be beneath dogshit.

August 16, 2007 @ 1:05 pm | Comment

Ivan: riots throughout beijing? where exactly? Certainly not at gongti as I was there shortly after the game. A few excited and angry youth smashing bottles against walls and shouting, but riots? as in fighting with police, burning vehicles and looting stores? I don’t think so. I feel you are being just a little melodramatic to prove a (non) point.

Closest I saw to a riot was in sanlitun when a chinese boy threw a bottle against a wall. he missed the wall and the bottle went through the window of a small retsaurant. the owner was not happy and words were exchanged. not quite toxteth 1981 but a better reflection of what actually happened that night.

stuart: t-cup was not being juvenile, just factual. the ref did miss a handball and the japanese scored. they may have won anyway, but that doesn’t change the fact that poor refereeing benefitted japan that evening. I don’t see how pointing this out is juvenile. If you want juvenile, talk to an england fan about the hand of god.

goodnight

August 16, 2007 @ 2:38 pm | Comment

“t-cup was not being juvenile, just factual. the ref did miss a handball and the japanese scored.”

Well, mickeylove, you missed the ship as it sailed by. My point was that some events, football being one example, are not officialed with total objectivity; the rules of the game make a degree of human error inevitable. This will be true for many Olympic events.

That t_co found it necessary to mention the handball incident at all speaks volumes for the way the fragile ego of many Chinese will seek to blame others if things don’t go their way next year. Hope this clears things up.

August 16, 2007 @ 5:24 pm | Comment

ferins, if you object to “thinking China is communist in anything but name”, then try an experiment: Post a blog in Chinese dedicated to arguing this point, and see how long it stays up before the Communist Party’s internet censors take it down.

August 16, 2007 @ 5:38 pm | Comment

Well, on the issue of fragile egos and football I have to side with the Chinese fragile ego. In football there are only fragile egos. It’s just not just a game.
And the f*** ball was not in the f*** goal in f *** 1966.
And Italy only won this time because of their special training (http://tinyurl.com/34xay4). Nuf said.

August 16, 2007 @ 6:41 pm | Comment

Comparing modern China to Mao era China and thinking China is communist in anything but name would truly be beneath dogshit.

Is it… ironic… That this statement is the result of the new shape of Communist propaganda?

Now instead of spitting “mao is God”, the Chinese spit, “the mao era is over, we are free”

Your words are within the frame of how the CCP has moulded you, you are not free from totalitarian threat, and the party has you by the balls, don’t you feel it? Or are you so obedient that you just know where to put your balls so you dont feel the grip?

That has become the sad solution of the people in China, they treat the party as God and they put their minds as the party requires to save their souless skins from the partys threat, the perfect accomplishment for the CCP.

I dare you to break the limits! I dare you to publish the truth in China and stand up for freedom of thought and expression!

It just doesnt seem very “maoist” cause the CCP has refined you and barely has to deal with any conflicts anymore, the Chinese are settled into the fear of the party and they accept it, so you dont see as much blood.

But do you really think that if the people had some spirit the party would tolerate it any better than in mao era?

HAH, this time theyd have no choice cause of globalization and their need to suck up to other countries.

They tried to pull a mao rage and terror upon FGAOLNUGN but because of globalization, they wont be able to erase it from history this time.

So the only thing thats different is that the party has no ability to really exercise as much terror, but do you really think that if they thought it would benefit them they wouldnt kill whomever?

August 17, 2007 @ 5:42 am | Comment

shut the hell up, jesus christ. i’m taiwanese, not chinese.

just not a brainless american lapdog who is willing to throw myself at beijing to benefit washington.

August 17, 2007 @ 6:00 am | Comment

Heard of a group called “Chthonic”?

August 17, 2007 @ 11:05 am | Comment

as talented as they are at screeching and making funny faces, i’m not going to follow some artist into mutual destruction for china and taiwan for the sake of american interests.

taiwan is as independent as it will ever be; if they move too much in either direction they’ll just be a vassal of either china or the united states.

August 18, 2007 @ 7:09 am | Comment

Dear ferins,

You claimed to be Taiwanese, not Chinese. If this is the case, why would you refer to Taiwanese as “they” rather than “us”? It sounds really odd to me.

You are the first Taiwanese I’ve ever met who would argue that China is anything but “communist”. You also seemed to be offended when Ivan brought up the fact about internet censorship in China. You’re indeed a Taiwanese with a very interesting perspective on Mainland China. Care to elaborate a bit for me please.

Not wanting to be an American vassal is one thing. But not recognising the strategic importance of Taiwan’s alliance with the US and refusing to acknowledge how this alliance enabled Taiwan to maintain its “independent” status quo is, to say the least, ignorant, if not dishonest.

August 18, 2007 @ 3:38 pm | Comment

Taiwan has had strategic relationships with BOTH the U.S and China. If you haven’t heard moderate standings from Taiwanese, then you’re hanging out with the wrong people. Most of the intelligent people in Taiwan are not pro-independence or pro-(immediate) reunification. I rarely refer to any groups as “we” because I don’t speak for everyone.

My perspective on Mainland China is that they aren’t exactly a true enemy of the United States, but rather neoconservatives fear and hate China and anything else that challenges their power. Much of the propaganda American media spews against China and Chinese (the ethnic group) is because of fear and hate, NOT any legitimate concern for EITHER Taiwanese or Chinese. Either that, or they care, but they’re just really stupid and incompetent diplomats.

What most Taiwanese want is to maintain peace with China and normal relations with the U.S. We want business with China and we want China to reform.

I consider myself culturally Chinese, NOT only Taiwanese. The language, traditions, and the very fabric of our society is Chinese. More Chinese than China, unfortunately. My views stem from the fact that I feel Chinese culture is valid in the modern world and has worth, and I want China to become more Chinese through a positive influence from Taiwan. That, and then there are the economic opportunities that Taiwan and China can mutually benefit from.

This is what drives my support of moderate, realistic relations with China. Not overexaggerated slander and sloganeering that makes Chinese people take offense and shirk from moderate suggestions and encouragement of reformation. Tone is *everything*. Taiwanese people know this more than anyone else; one word, if declared, threatened the utter destruction of all of Taiwan.

Has anyone learned why Mao was able to come to power? After the 8 Nations Alliance bankrupted China, and the IJA destroyed what remained, anti-colonial sentiment came with the misery that foreign powers inflicted on the Chinese people. The CCP exists because the Chinese people believe they need staunch anti-colonial leaders. They perceive certain attacks by American media, the behaviors of some of their companies, etc to be neocolonial threats.

So they’re willing to sacrifice some (or quite a lot) of their freedoms for this protection. The rest is more complex. But people like nanhe aren’t helping things, suffice it to say.

August 19, 2007 @ 4:26 am | Comment

Mao came to power because he was supported by Stalin and the KGB.

You sound very KMT ferins.

August 19, 2007 @ 12:10 pm | Comment

“They perceive certain attacks by American media, the behaviors of some of their companies, etc to be neocolonial threats.”

“Perceive” is a poor, if not misleading, choice of word. The ccp PRESENT criticism from the west as threatening in order to promote nationalism and thereby retain their grip on power.

August 19, 2007 @ 2:33 pm | Comment

“You sound very KMT ferins.”

People who aren’t idiots, ignoramuses or assholes in Taiwan aren’t DPP. There are maybe a handful of exceptions.

“The ccp PRESENT criticism from the west”

The few people who do slip through the cracks of China’s censorship end up finding that their fears are confirmed, generally.

Take a look at youtube comments for an example of what kind of impression they get of “foreigners” on the net.

August 19, 2007 @ 4:22 pm | Comment

“Take a look at youtube comments for an example of what kind of impression they get of “foreigners” on the net.”

Better still, take a look at the anti-western comments left unmoderated on the China Daily forums for an example of how the CCP wants to present the west to the people it purports to protect.

August 19, 2007 @ 7:24 pm | Comment

“Better still, take a look at the anti-western comments left unmoderated on the China Daily forums for an example of how the CCP wants to present the west to the people it purports to protect.”

They get deleted in half a second or they’re based in truth.

August 20, 2007 @ 1:08 am | Comment

“””””””””Has anyone learned why Mao was able to come to power? After the 8 Nations Alliance bankrupted China, and the IJA destroyed what remained, anti-colonial sentiment came with the misery that foreign powers inflicted on the Chinese people. The CCP exists because the Chinese people believe they need staunch anti-colonial leaders. They perceive certain attacks by American media, the behaviors of some of their companies, etc to be neocolonial threats.”””””””””

I think maybe 1/10 of the reason is that people wanted anti colonial staunchness, and the other nine tenths:

Lying, propaganda, brainwashing, changing the culture, bribery, threats, torture, killing, hate incitement…

“”They get deleted in half a second or they’re based in truth.””

BASED in truth? Don’t sound to sure there.

By the way you said Americans were against China and the people, can you back that up? As I see it Americans (who have brains) see communist regimes for the antihuman rights tyrants that they are, but against China the country and the people of China? I find that hard to believe. Why would America be against China and Chinese people?

It’s true the Chinese people are dangerous and crazy under the regime so it can be hard to know that Chinese people arent really like that underneath…

August 20, 2007 @ 10:28 am | Comment

stu

your pseudo intellectualising around the subject of sport doesn’t change the fact that the referee made a bad decision and that the chinese had every right to complain about that. and no doubt will harbour a grudge for many years to come nothing to do with fragile egos or sour grapes; everything to do with the inherent nature of of a game that I feel you perhaps don’t understand too well – just ask the germans 1966, england 1986, Italy 2000 and countless more football fans on a club level.

your are politicizing in the wrong place, I feel.

and ivan – those riots – gone a bit quiet in that one haven’t you?

August 20, 2007 @ 3:23 pm | Comment

“…and ivan – those riots – gone a bit quiet in that one haven’t you?…”

Just like the local victims did.

August 20, 2007 @ 4:02 pm | Comment

“I think maybe 1/10 of the reason is that people wanted anti colonial staunchness, and the other nine tenths:

Lying, propaganda, brainwashing, changing the culture, bribery, threats, torture, killing, hate incitement…”

That was later. I’m talking about the very beginning, ever since their pro-American sentiments before the May Fourth Movement failed them spectacularly. Can you believe they expected America to help them against warlords and the Japanese? Talk about naive.

“Why would America be against China and Chinese people?”

A mix of xenophobia, racism, stupidity, and a general discomfort with losing their relative status in their world. Look up “yellow peril” and its history in America ever since they were treating railroad workers like shit, to the Chinese exclusion act, and to the modern age.

If you read the contemporary fiction, one of the prevailing fears was a unified and modernized entity encompassing Japan and China that would be the ultimate “yellow peril”.

America attacked Japan not because they could give two shits about how many millions of Chinese were butchered (they even considered wiping out the entirety of Asia from Moscow to Guangdong with nuclear weapons) but because they feared a powerful and belligerent (forcefully) unified Asia under Japan.

And if America were so keen on helping the ROC they’d have done it before we lost 97% of our ground.

August 20, 2007 @ 4:23 pm | Comment

Since Ferins has so much “faith” in the “fairness” of the China Daily forum, he/she wouldn’t mind me quoting the following comment from that forum. It was a part of a thread titled “who really will fight for Taiwan independence?”:

“First of all, it is plain to see that no one could stop the overwhelming progressing of modern China and no one can afford the price they have to pay to involve in a conflict with China. Most of westerners, though spoiled white pigs like you are exceptions, have to acknowledge this. And the more powerful China becomes the more impossible for Taiwan to acquire its independence. Taiwan sees no chance to be independent even when there is a long way to go for mainland to reclaim it. Status quo is granted by the mercy of mainland government not to attack Chinese on the other side of the strait. What is more, the result of that those islander secessionists defying mainland again and again may well turn out to be bring forward the schedule of reunification when mainland has no reconciling space but taking firm action, and that concerns Uncle Sam.

If you believe that boycotting Chinese goods is a good idea, then try it. However I am afraid that most of Americans will not follow you unless they are pure idiot like you.
Have fun, babbling baby.”

The comment is signed off as �������ܣ������л�

I like the way this commenter called westerners “spoiled white pig”. Acording to Ferins, China Daily deleted all false anti-westerner comments. This comment must have been endorsed by the China Daily – it remained there since it was posted on 18 August.

Contrary to Ferins’s suggestions, I have very rational and intelligent Taiwanese friends, who will never choose to bury their heads in the sand when it comes to assessing the past, present and future of the Communist regime in Mainland China.

August 20, 2007 @ 5:28 pm | Comment

God d@mn it! Couldn’t display the Chinese characters. Try again: 不忘国耻，振兴中华.

August 20, 2007 @ 5:37 pm | Comment

“I like the way this commenter called westerners “spoiled white pig””

Yeah, where would Condoleeza Rice fit in there?

August 20, 2007 @ 6:21 pm | Comment

“spoiled white pig”.

Why don’t you cry about it? This is fairly harmless, there’s stuff about Chinese people there of that caliber. Especially the men. Things like ethnic cleansing, suggesting violence against foreigners, get zapped in about 5 minutes.

You must be of the opinion that CCP higher-ups monitor every second of every single person in China’s existence.

August 20, 2007 @ 6:49 pm | Comment

“Look up “yellow peril” and its history in America ever since they were treating railroad workers like shit…”

I knew it was a question of time before we touched a raw nerve connected to that most childish aspect of Chinese pride – the huge chip carried on the shoulders of millions about the past treatment of their forbears.

It’s also, in my experience, a trademark response among those Chinese I’ve met who have a very antagonistic attitude towards the west.

August 20, 2007 @ 9:46 pm | Comment

“spoiled white pig”.

‘Why don’t you cry about it? This is fairly harmless, there’s stuff about Chinese people there of that caliber.”

Show us. Tit.

“(they even considered wiping out the entirety of Asia from Moscow to Guangdong with nuclear weapons)”

Again, evidence, please. Actually, don’t bother it didn’t happen. I wonder why.

“A mix of xenophobia, racism, stupidity, and a general discomfort with losing their relative status in their world. ”

Which country are we taliking about?

August 20, 2007 @ 11:28 pm | Comment

All news must be good news, says Chinese government

Jonathan Watts in Beijing
Saturday August 18, 2007
The Guardian

China has ordered its media to report only positive news and has imprisoned a pro-democracy dissident amid a clampdown on dissent ahead of the most important meeting of the communist party in five years.

Media controls have been tightened, Aids activists detained and NGOs shut down as president Hu Jintao prepares for the 17th party congress, when the next generation of national leaders will be unveiled in a politburo reshuffle.

Chen Shuqing, who is a founder member of the banned China Democracy party, suffered the toughest punishment meted out so far when he was found guilty on Thursday of “inciting people to overthrow the government”.

Article continues
The intermediate people’s court in Hangzhou, Zhejiang province, sentenced him to four years in prison. Chen was an outspoken critic of the Communist party, although because of the tightly controlled traditional media his campaigning in recent years was largely restricted to the internet.

The free-speech group Reporters Without Borders said it was appalled by the verdict. “Courts taking their orders from the Communist party continue to crack down on cyber-dissidents,” the Paris-based organisation said. “We reiterate our appeal for the release of Chen and the 50 other cyber-dissidents and internet users held in China.”

With the congress nearing – the exact date is a secret, but it is expected in October – the domestic media have been banned from conducting independent investigations of food and product safety stories. In Beijing the municipal propaganda department has issued detailed instructions to editors on how they should cover the test of traffic-easing measures, which started today. During the four-day trial more than 1m cars have been ordered off the roads. Local newspapers and TV stations can only report on the improvements to the environment and transportation. Interviews with inconvenienced commuters or images of overcrowded buses are forbidden.

Most state media have also been banned from reporting on the collapse of a bridge in southern China which killed at least 41 people. Reporters said local officials punched them and chased them from the scene of Monday’s disaster.

On Wednesday the government issued new regulations that prohibit false news and illegal TV coverage. This is ostensibly a response to a fabricated report last month about cardboard being used as a filling for steamed buns. Zi Beijia, the TV journalist held responsible for the fake story, has been jailed for a year.

“This crackdown is a legal gun to the head to responsible journalists who want to report on the basis of facts,” said Sophie Richardson, deputy Asia director at Human Rights Watch.

August 20, 2007 @ 11:48 pm | Comment

“I knew it was a question of time before we touched a raw nerve connected to that most childish aspect of Chinese pride – the huge chip carried on the shoulders of millions about the past treatment of their forbears.”

Thanks for ignoring the point. The simple fact is, many Americans are xenophobic, stupid, and racist. Always has been, emphasis on the “stupid”. According to self-polls at least. I answered snow’s question truthfully, it wasn’t a value judgment.

If you don’t like it, it’s not my problem.

“Show us. Tit.”

Go read anything by “joey411” or some other combination of a four and two ones.

“Again, evidence, please. Actually, don’t bother it didn’t happen. I wonder why.”

It was brought up in discussion at top-levels, Truman didn’t approve, to say the least.

“Which country are we taliking about?”

Don’t be the bitter expat whining about how his special treatment isn’t special enough.

August 21, 2007 @ 2:17 am | Comment

if anyone wants to read human rights watch’s report….

http://china.hrw.org/press/china_no_progress_on_rights_one_year_before_olympi
cs

China: No Progress on Rights One Year Before Olympics

Human Rights Abuses Shadow Countdown to 2008 Beijing Games

(New York, August 2, 2007) � China�s dire human rights record and a renewed
crackdown on media freedom may spoil the government�s hopes of a successful
�coming out party� at the Beijing Olympics, which begin in a year, Human Rights
Watch said today.
A year before the August 8, 2008 opening ceremonies for the Beijing Olympics,
the Chinese government shows no substantive progress in addressing
long-standing human rights concerns. Instead, apparently more worried about
political stability, Beijing is tightening its grip on domestic human rights
defenders, grassroots activists and media to choke off any possible expressions
of dissent ahead of the Games.

�Instead of a pre-Olympic �Beijing spring� of greater freedom and tolerance of
dissent, we are seeing the gagging of dissidents, a crackdown on activists, and
attempts to block independent media coverage,� said Brad Adams, Asia director
at Human Rights Watch. �The government seems afraid that its own citizens will
embarrass it by speaking out about political and social problems, but China�s
leaders apparently don�t realize authoritarian crackdowns are even more
embarrassing.�

China has a well-documented history of serious human rights abuses, including
widespread torture, censorship of the media and internet, controls on religious
freedom, and repression of ethnic minorities in Tibet and Xinjiang. …………………….

But I guess some will say that this is all in the name of antichina sentiment and people make all this up to somehow make America more powerful, well I wish that was true (well that would be wak as well…) but it’s not, the CCP is a great shame to say the least.

August 21, 2007 @ 11:08 am | Comment

still better than America’s human rights record.

August 21, 2007 @ 11:38 am | Comment

The above comment by ferins says it all. People who live in a hole in the ground clearly wouldn’t recognize a beam of sunlight if it hit them square in the tuchus. They convince themselves that despite incredibly narrow perspective, they know all their is to know about things well beyond their perception, experience and comprehension.

There’s a time to stop pointless debate with hole-dwellers. They contribute nothing except ignorance. On the up side, you don’t really have to take offence at what they say. Why be offended by someone who clearly doesn’t know shit?

August 21, 2007 @ 12:36 pm | Comment

that’s solely by a death count tally. unless you’re going back into the mao era, then mao wins. in a sense.

but if you’re talking recent times, yeah, it’s worse.

August 21, 2007 @ 3:54 pm | Comment

but since you resent it so much, i’m going to keep “beaming down your hole” (terrible analogies galore) just to spite you.

August 21, 2007 @ 3:56 pm | Comment

This whole blog has become a tireless carousel of the same five or six people going around and around and around. If it’s not “the CCP sucks” then it’s “Bush is Satan.” If it’s not “FLG should be tolerated” then it’s “Condi Rice/Cheney/Rove is the next in line to Satan.” Tiresome. Damn tiresome. I’ve read this blog for three years, but I’m now deleting it from my bookmarks. I know no one cares. Just food for thought. It has totally lost whatever inspiration it once had and now serves as nothing more than an intellectual circle jerk. You guys keep it up. Maybe you’ll eventually accomplish something here. Like the Duck Pond, this blog is dying a slow, thankless death. Unlike those that threaten to disappear and then return when they’re bored, I’m gone. Be productive. Selah.

August 21, 2007 @ 5:05 pm | Comment

this blog is pretty much about how china is evil and the sky is falling, so what do you expect?

August 21, 2007 @ 5:20 pm | Comment

Canrun’s version of a productive blog is one frequented by Malaysian based Chinese nationalists, who would go on and on about the imminent non-stoppable deluge of a China Tsunami. I’ll let you guess how this view of China will appeal to a libertarian.

August 21, 2007 @ 5:41 pm | Comment

As for our friend Ferins: ditto to what the Iron Buddha said.

August 21, 2007 @ 5:43 pm | Comment

“It has totally lost whatever inspiration it once had and now serves as nothing more than an intellectual circle jerk”

Funny thing is, I thought the most recent thread titled “Sick” – in which some of us started exchanging jokes and music clips – was a symptom of this place becoming a fun place again.

But Libertarians don’t believe in “fun”, unless it has some “market” motive which isn’t fun at all…..

August 21, 2007 @ 8:48 pm | Comment

PS, Canrun paraphrased some of us as saying, “Bush is Satan.”

No. No he isn’t. Personally I’d rather drink with Satan than with Bush, because Satan is a hell of a lot more intelligent and, dare I say, even more honourable. And at least Satan only attacks WORTHY enemies, like God – not weak little cartoon characters like Saddam.

August 21, 2007 @ 8:51 pm | Comment

Bush is too incompetent to manage even 1% of the population inflow to Hell.

August 22, 2007 @ 9:59 am | Comment