A practical compromise solution?
I think it’s safe to say that if Japanese State visits to Yasukuni ceased Yasukuni were destroyed, Northeast Asia would be a happier place.
But what if Japan’s Class-A war dead (or criminals depending which side of the fence you stand on) were moved into a different facility with a different name bearing a different status?
Such a move would allow figures like the Emperor or Prime Minister to pay their respects without violating Japan’s constitution separating religion and state and it would not be seen as “worshiping” but as remembering.
Would the old wounds begin to heal in other parts of Northeast Asia or is anger toward Japan, its war crimes and such visits destined to live on forever?
Such a move would allow figures like the Emperor or Prime Minister to pay their respects without violating Japan’s constitution separating religion and state and it would not be seen as “worshiping” but as remembering.
Would the old wounds begin to heal in other parts of Northeast Asia or is anger toward Japan, its war crimes and such visits destined to live on forever?
These are questions Japan is attempting to answer as a non-partisan group has been formed with the mission to determine if a new facility should be built to house Yasukuni’s war dead. It is seen as an option that might help ease the dissent that has come from both within and outside of Japan in regards to the Emperor and Prime Minister’s visits to the current place.
As a third party observer with nothing to lose or gain from such a decision, I believe this is a positive move toward opening the door to compromise. (Key word here is compromise.)
Perhaps the name Yasukuni has such a strong stigma attached to it that it might be best to start over from scratch.
Sounds good. My question is, would there be a big group hug and cozy feelings of “let bygones by bygones,” or would another issue quickly supplant Yasukuni and continue to keep the wounds festering? There’s so much invested in fanning this flame. Nearly all arguments on the subject of Chinese anger against Japan come back to the shrine. There will be grudging recognition of the apologies. “But what about the shrine??” If that were taken out of the equation, would it pacify anyone? Or would it quickly be forgotten as the flame-fanners find some other Japanese horror to latch onto?
1
By Gordon
so, why not move Arlington Cemetery?
November 10, 2005 @ 10:44 pm | Comment
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By richard
I didn’t know Arlington cemetery was home to really nasty war criminals and was managed by a psychotic bunch of revisionists longing for the “good old days” of militarism and ultra-nationalism. Yasukuni really has become a vile place and I’d love to see it and its managing directors totally marginalized.
November 10, 2005 @ 11:08 pm | Comment
3
By Shanghai Slim
I’m not optimistic.
If, after seventeen (? I lost count) apologies, many Chinese still tenaciously declare that Japan has never apologized, I don’t think moving the “class A” dead, or even nuking the cemetary into oblivion, would really change much. The manufactured rage would just be focused on a new flashpoint.
Sign of the times: in one of my IELTS classes I have a full-on “ha-ri”, Chinese slang for a Chinese person that looks/acts like a Japanese (J-rock, Japanese fashions, anime, etc). This teenage girl is always carrying or wearing j-rock paraphanelia and bringing Japanese fashion-rock videos to class.
Last week she surprised me by vehemently declaring “I hate ALL Japanese.” I asked not to say such things in my classroom. This prompted her to state it again, more stidently.
Every time I encounter one of these walking paradoxes, I become more depressed over Sino-Japanese relations.
November 11, 2005 @ 4:13 am | Comment
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By richard
Yasukuni sucks ass big time, as the South Park kids would say. But it’s a convenience, something that makes arguing against Japan easy. It truly sucks, especially those old psychos marching around in warior outfits urging a return to the Tojo days. But if it were gone, you’re quite right, it wouldn’t matter a fig. There will soon be another figurehead monument to rise from its ashes, another example to rant about. It’s a national pastime, for some; like getting into a nice warm bath, it feels good and soothing to retreat into your prejudices and luxuriate in the irresistible power of the two-minute hate. It’s hard to give up. It’s addictive.
November 11, 2005 @ 4:52 am | Comment
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By buyo
Very pertinentt and very true.
November 11, 2005 @ 6:12 am | Comment
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By dishuiguanyin
ACB did a very detailed post about the issues surrounding Yasukuni. I strongly recommend it. Original version and mirror vision.
November 11, 2005 @ 9:31 am | Comment
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By Raj
Pie in the sky, I’m afraid. That will never happen because the Yasukuni priests have the final say. Hell will freeze over before they let their nationalist symbol be deconstructed.
Also I believe there is already a separate memorial somewhere in the area. Can’t remember its name though.
And yes, even if Yasukuni was gone tomorrow, there would something. Not just the textbooks, but territorial disputes, attitudes of politicians, etc, etc. If you want to be insulted, anything can be an insult. If you have a thick skin, you can weather anything.
November 11, 2005 @ 10:11 am | Comment
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By Shanghai Slim
ACB, really informative post, well done! Thanks for the links, Dishie (enjoyed both of your cogent comments there, as well)!
November 11, 2005 @ 8:34 pm | Comment
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By ACB
Raj
Yasakuni’s priests only have the last word in Yasakuni, which won’t be the national war memorial for much longer, so what they think will be irelevant.
November 12, 2005 @ 2:05 am | Comment
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By ACB
I am in absolutely no doubt that China would simply move on to the next issue, Nanjing, text books, chemical weapons.
There might be celebrations when it happens, but pretty soon afterwards somebody will stand up and say that the new memorial is not enough because of all of the other issues, or that it is a smokescreen to allow Japan to go on as it always has done while saying that it isn’t.
Feelings are just too strong for an easy resolution.
You are also forgetting that all Tokyo can do is to switch official recognition away from Yasakuni. It can’t rip it down and it can’t actually remove class A war dead. What Japan will have is two sites, one memorial and one shrine. Yasakuni will still exist. Nationalists will simply say that it is the ‘true’ site and will continue as ever.
November 12, 2005 @ 2:11 am | Comment
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By ACB
Richard
The war shrine and museums are only a small part of Yasakuni.
It is a really beautiful place, especially in springtime. It has centuries of history and tradition that are not tainted by the memorial and are not related to WWII. If you can’t appreciate that, then you are missing something.
Arlington has its fare share of war criminals, only they were never convicted, because America either won its wars, or as was the case with Korea and Vietnam, its criminals were never put on trial.
I dare say that Kenedy would have been found guilty of war crimes had the Vietnames ever gotten their hands on him.
A man who kills millions is a monster, but he is only a war criminal if he loses.
November 12, 2005 @ 2:24 am | Comment
12
By Battlepanda
I actually see the girl crazy about the pop culture in Japan but still professing hatred for ‘all japanese’ as a very positive sign. People of this generation don’t want to carry on grieviances of the previous generation. They want Hello Kitty tat from Japan (or whatever it is thesedays) and cheap consumer goods from China in the other direction. So, anti-Japanese sentiments is actually very unnatural, and fueled by two things.
First, it is encouraged by forces of bigotry in China, aided and abetted occasionally by the gov when it suits them. Second, it is a reaction to the forces of bigotry in Japan, extending all the way up to Koizumi.
People on this blog seem very certain that the first is the overwhelming factor, because Japan did apologize again and again over the years. Then again, those apologies must be somewhat discounted in the eyes of the chinese because, oh I don’t know, the prime minister of Japan still honors war criminals every fricking year.
I would love to see Japan take the course of action Richard outlined regarding Yakusuni (which is one thing that still really bother Taiwanese people, despite the fact that we are pro-Japanese in general). It would be good for Japan because it can’t make sino-japanese relations any worse, and all they would be giving up is what has become a morally indefensible monstrosity anyhow.
I could make some statement here about how it’ll never happen (because the Japanese are sooo intransigent, because their leaders are using ugly nationalist sentiments to consolidate their own popularity, basically all the crap that’s being said about the chinese). But I won’t. Because, as undoubtedly inconsequential as this blog comment is, I don’t indulge in presumpsuous and counterproductive speculation about the nature of other people’s national character.
November 12, 2005 @ 2:38 am | Comment
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By Otaku
To Richard, Raj, ACB, and others like you:
I am usually civil and educated; but since I am pissed right now, here goes?
Instead of talking about all this cr*p, can I and my mates just rape your mothers, sisters, girlfriends, wives, daughters, etc? Then can we cut them up along with your fathers, brothers, sons, mates, bros, etc? And instead of being prosecuted for the hideous crime that I and my mates did, we get away with our crime Scott-free.
Then after sixty years later; can I come back to you, the survivor, and say to you that we ?regret? it happened, but we actually were liberating you, doing good to you, and making you stronger? Instead of showing remorse, can we say it?s time to move on and you will forgive us, because we have apologised with hundreds of ?regret??
If this happened to you and you did as you preach, then maybe you can come back and lecture to people from China, Corea, or whatever. Until then, STFU.
And to think I am originally from Taiwan, and is a lot more friendly towards nihonjin, even with all their racism, lies, BS, and such.
May 8, 2006 @ 7:26 pm | Comment
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By richard
My relatives were slaughtered at Auschwitz. I can preach, believe me. Another angry, victimized Chinese young man. Sigh. 🙂
May 8, 2006 @ 7:46 pm | Comment
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By Otaku
What do you call any Jews or Israelis who is anti-nazi revisionist?
Jews or Israelis
What do you call any east-Asians who is anti-Japanese revisionist?
An anti-Japanese, anti-West, anti-anything. Any thing but an east-Asian.
We east-Asians should just learn from the Israelis; many in the world are no where to be seen when their survival is at stake, again and again. But feels the right to Monday-quarterback them with opinions when it is politically-correct to do so.
May 8, 2006 @ 7:52 pm | Comment
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By Otaku
With all due respect to your experiences, Richard; you can not preach. Did this happen to your people?
“Then after sixty years later; can I come back to you, the survivor, and say to you that we ?regret? it happened, but we actually were liberating you, doing good to you, and making you stronger? Instead of showing remorse, can we say it?s time to move on and you will forgive us, because we have apologised with hundreds of ?regret??”
No, your people had some form of closure. East-Asians did not.
May 8, 2006 @ 8:01 pm | Comment
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By richard
We’ve been through this a trillion times. Yeah, I feel your pain – really. But stop raging against today’s Japanese, many generations later. Go out and cry if it makes you feel better, write letters, start a blog – but stop your whining and playing victim 60 years after the fact, and many years after Mao made peace with Japan on the issues. The only reason you’re moaning and groaning now is that the post-Tiananmen Square CCP fanned the flames under this issue, which China had literally forgotten under mao. And you’re the perfect sap, responding like a well-trained dog to the dog whistle. Grow up and think for yourself.
May 8, 2006 @ 8:06 pm | Comment
18
By Otaku
It is funny how you, Richard, make a judgement about who I am, what I know, and how I think even before you know me. Assuming I am one of those CCP trolls.
It is also funny how I type my response, and you type your response, and even though I did not read your response, my response responds to your response.
It is unfortunate that you want to make me into one of your stereotypes, so you could just dismiss my arguments as idiotic, instead of addressing to the concerns of people who are not like me, but reach similar conclusions. Whatever.
I am not here to be adversarial, and I am not going to respond to a challenge to make it one.
But I will say one thing, it is an issue after sixty years because we thought Japan had been remorseful, that is why we forgave but not forget. But as we, the common east-Asians get to know more ENGLISH, we get to find out what has been happening without our knowledge. If Japan was not remorseful, then we will start to demand they become remorseful, and actually show PROOF that they are remorseful for their crime.
I will also say one thing, even with understanding of the Chinese or Korean language, there is still a long way to go for you to understand us, if you chose to do so.
But seems at least the western media decides every Asian is like this or that, whatever.
May 8, 2006 @ 9:03 pm | Comment
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By Travis
“I didn’t know Arlington cemetery was home to really nasty war criminals and was managed by a psychotic bunch of revisionists longing for the ‘good old days’ of militarism and ultra-nationalism.”
No? Perhaps you should get out more.
August 14, 2006 @ 8:18 pm | Comment